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Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

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July 08, 2007 06:22PM
The various issues that create a definite friction between all sides of the ORV Recreation debate, do stir up a significant amount of strong emotions. Lawless behavior by parties, on either side of the argument is certainly not productive, or beneficial, and in most cases just illicits further anger between those having these disagreements. The high desert demographics, and housing density certainly has changed enormously in recent decades. The activities of ORV riding that years ago went un-noticed because of less people, and more open areas, now impacts more often those that are adverse to the noise, dust, private property intrusions, etc. From what I have experienced, as an area gradually becomes more populated, and dense with housing, eventually there is enough reaction to irresponsible ORV riding that the people affected, ( generally representing larger numbers than the riding enthusiast ) seek to find a remedy in newly inacted laws. Within the more populated dense rural and city areas, enforcement of these new ordinances is more affective, because of more complaints, and more law officers in the vicinity. Enforcement of ORV laws in the open wildland areas is for the most part, very ineffective because of too much area, and too few law officers. For example, Mojave Green, who owns many hundreds of acres adjacent to the Bowen Ranch RD, experiences much difficulty keeping illegal ORV riding from tresspassing and damaging his land. Some of these errant riders even cut fences in retaliatory acts. The reality is, there will always be a part of the ORV riding community, that will be more aggressive in thier acts, and will ignore the riding rules, no matter where they ride. It is certainly fair to say also, that there are many very responsible citizens who enjoy thier ORV activities in a legal manner. Hopefully you ( Allen ) will see the wisdom of being part of the latter category, instead of perhaps being involved with the activites of the former. You have implied certain things here in this thread, and I realize this may not be representative of your actual history of riding. As respect goes, its best not to imply things about yourself, if these things are not truly representative of your activites, or character. There are alot of roads, and trails open to legal riding around the Juniper Flats area. I don't think you really would suggest that the BLM or USFS lands should be open to unlimited ORV travel, anywhere the ORV enthusiast might wish to go. I think you would also understand, that just as you wish to respected in the rights you have as a landowner, that other folks with land, small and large, reasonably should be given the same respect. I think its safe to say that the legal routes available to ORV enthusiast, do not cross private property owners land, except in certain special circumstances. I think ORV riders, as part of the responsible usage of thier vehicles, and in consideration of the places they travel, should make themselves reasonably aware of the legal areas or routes they can recreate in. Along with this, local agencies hopefully will have sensible signage, so the ORV people can know where the routes are. I know there are some irresponsible ORV riders who will destroy and remove signage, so they can claim ignorance of riding illegally in certain areas. So you are frustrated by the changing nature of your riding experience over the past couple of decades, but hopefully you consider too that other folks who don't necesarily share a particular interest in ORV activities, and feel that the enjoyment of various outdoor environs, and the peaceful enjoyment of thier private property, has been compromised by illegal or excessive ORV impacts, such as excessive noise or dust, off legal route riding, aggressive behavior, etc. As you suggest, I think its clear that there will be continueing, and even increasing disagreements on this subject. Mojave Green has indicated a new respect for you based on one of your most recent post. Perhaps it would bring benifits, and more understanding, if you, Mojave, and possibly even Dave could meet to disuss your mutual considerations regarding this contentious subject. Maybe you might find that some common ground can be found. Its just a suggestion. Hopefully everybody stays safe, and folks do not get riled up to the point of aggressive, threatening, or illegal behaviors. Being in an angered state is never benificial, in addressing frustrations and problems. Sometimes its hard to let go of the anger, when one feels intruded upon by the various challenges life always brings, but IMHO, its always the best way to go. Also, sometimes the best way to solve a problem, is too find a creative, as well as satisfying way to not be impacted by it. Go around the problem, instead of spending more energy just butting heads with it. This can represent the easiest and most satisfactory solution in many cases, and may be relevant in one form or another, to your ORV riding frustrations. Anyway, hopefully the disagreements as discussed in this thread will find a peaceful solution.
SubjectAuthorViewsPosted

Reckless off-roaders called scourge

katrina island 1590June 29, 2007 02:46PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

LaughingBear 608June 29, 2007 10:34PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Rick 692June 29, 2007 10:35PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 692July 02, 2007 10:45AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

desertdude 611July 02, 2007 02:19PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 684July 02, 2007 06:22PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 601July 03, 2007 03:12PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 575July 03, 2007 06:24PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Rick 719July 03, 2007 06:29PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 550July 03, 2007 10:36PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Rick 671July 03, 2007 11:34PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 656July 04, 2007 03:01PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Paul P. 613June 30, 2007 08:39AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

LaughingBear 666July 04, 2007 07:38PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

desertdude 723July 04, 2007 08:07PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Rick 704July 05, 2007 12:21AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 638July 05, 2007 05:35PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

LaughingBear 578July 05, 2007 07:07PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 590July 05, 2007 07:46PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Rick 596July 06, 2007 12:09AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 1332July 06, 2007 07:52AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 706July 06, 2007 08:20AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 621July 06, 2007 10:52AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 626July 06, 2007 08:38AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 670July 06, 2007 10:45AM

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mojavegreen 657July 06, 2007 06:28PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 607July 06, 2007 07:02PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 665July 06, 2007 10:05PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 563July 07, 2007 06:56AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 668July 07, 2007 09:20AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 728July 07, 2007 04:52PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 642July 08, 2007 08:01AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 729July 08, 2007 02:23PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Wizard 718July 08, 2007 06:22PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 690July 08, 2007 07:04PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 633July 09, 2007 10:22AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 647July 09, 2007 10:31AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

mojavegreen 1080July 09, 2007 10:47AM

Albert responsible for graffiti at Springs?

mojavegreen 618July 06, 2007 10:22PM

Re: Albert responsible for graffiti at Springs?

mojavegreen 596July 06, 2007 10:33PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

LaughingBear 591July 07, 2007 09:56PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 614July 08, 2007 06:00AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 616July 08, 2007 06:15AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

LaughingBear 603July 08, 2007 06:08AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Wizard 653July 08, 2007 08:12AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

LaughingBear 647July 08, 2007 09:03PM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

Allen 733July 09, 2007 06:21AM

Re: Reckless off-roaders called scourge

LaughingBear 608July 09, 2007 07:57AM



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