Wizard, thanks for the clarification about Joe's comment about Mike being a "friend". My thick head didn't realize the comment was in jest! Ms. Windsor is Mike's current or former girlfriend. She seems to be very knowledgable of the ranch activities, and since she monitors this forum, she may be able to shed additional light on this serious incident. As you said, "if it happened as Jobe described", then it's very serious. And yes, even though Joe's posts are occasionally "filtered" for approval, he should be encouraged to provide more details.