Thank you , Gary. Even tho I'd love to drive up to God's country, just 4 the experience. I would probably need a mt. bike to keep up too. So maybe later. THANX Wizard for finishing my thoughts, once again. Like you I once defended Mike. After numerous attemps ( from what we used to call the Williamites) too persude me to think differantly. I none the less attempted to keep an open mind , as you have also Wizard. But after experiances too numerous to mention, and spanning to many years. And after hearing from too many others the same negative carma stories. It is now for certian my mind is completly made up. There is no dobt in my mind that Mike needs help from people smarter than me. How many here remember the Growler ?And how many saw 1st hand the many people he scared away from the area? So you see Mike is a repackaged Growler. Smarter and easier to take. And there for more dangerous. You proabably remember Ted Bundy. A smart and likeable guy. Mike is like that. Get it sicamore? It isn't just on this forum that these things are being said. His reputation and bad deeds are a part of the history of this magical place.O.K. So take off you rose colored glasses and put your pipe down and be more aware. On another note. Earlyer I stated "I would never harm anyone." May I retract that statement? Never say never is a good policy here. If I saw for sure some one like Mike doing harm to an innocent , you can bet there would be hell coming from my inner most being. :~) have a nice day :~)